Football talking points

First topic message reminder :

Rather than hijack the "which team do you support" thread where some of these are being talked about...

Some of the events of the weekend that are getting people talking

1) Mario Balotelli: plenty to say about him in general but specifically the alleged stamp on Scott Parker and his subsequent charge by the FA

2) Lescott's elbow on Kaboul(?) - FA say no charge to answer

3) Conspiracy theories in general about Man City!

4) Wenger's decision to take Chamberlain off and put Arshavin on - and Van Persie's reaction

5) Peter Crouch and the "eye-gouge"

6) Harry Redknapp and the tax-dodging allegations and court case

Discuss!

Just rushed in and switched on the goggle box! Defib and heart massage for 7minutes and continued in the ambulance according to sky, doesn't sound good and only 23years old!

Thoughts and prayers with him right now too young for such a tragedy, always thought us at arsenal should've kept him

He collapsed with no one around him. He appeared to be having some kind of seizure too as it looked like he was shaking whilst laying prostrate on the ground. The players looked grief stricken and the right decision was made to abandon the game very quickly.

Hopefully he will recover but this puts a lot of things in sport in perspective. Fingers crossed for a full recovery and thoughts and prayers for him and his family.

Talking points so far for me:

El Petro Crouchio - that finish from crouch was Ependary (I heard that on some dodgy us show a cross between epic and legendary) what a goal, I'd rate that up there with Marco Van Bastens volley at Euro 88 still the best goal in a european championship match.

Liverpool Comedy Club: how nice to see Kenny Dalgleish's awful tones silenced! Would be even better if they get beat in the FA cup and finish below Sunderland and newcastle in the league.

3rd place: nice to see my team up ahead of the yids again and slight gap of 3 points, like Robbie Di Matteo says and I agree Chelsea are out of the hunt, so just us and Arrys Boys! Oh and how annoying is it that everyone is calling Roberto Di Matteo bloody Robbie as if he's some sort of scouse home grown.

Fabrice Muambe, good progress and hopefully fully on the mend

Mav, what every team needs for a recovery is me predicting they should get rid of the manager like I said about Wenger. I'd like to go on record as saying Daglish should stay at the helm at Liverpool as long as he likes
Good to see Walcott proving us all wrong, very neat finish yesterday and looks full of confidence right now. Good for Arsenal and England.

Liverpool are a joke. If Hodgson was still there they would be challenging for champions league. The stats show that RH had better results than KD, and RH had no money to spend. Yet KD forced his way into the job and spent multi-millions. Liverpool and KD deserve each other

Nutjob Hoddle wants to manage England at Euro 2012? What do we all thnk about that?

I have to say though I've never been a big Hoddle fan, his record as England manager wasn't bad and it was only his crackpot opinions on non-footballing matters (and his connection with Eileen Drury) that were his downfall

Hoddle is a complete nutjob but!

As England manager he had fresh ideas, his teams defended well and counter attacking was bang on, his style of play far better than his successors of Sven, brolley boy, and Fabio.

If its an interim thing I'd give him it to do for the Euros, allow Redknapp if he is to be longterm man for the job a summer around watching what a major championship entails, then allow him the chance over the next couple years to do the job.

I think Hoddle was a good England manager. But that was then and this is now. He is older and not wiser, probably nuttier and hasnt really picked up anymore relevant experience. Not for me but might make for an interesting summer in all sorts of ways if it did happen.

Hoddle was a brilliant England manager. Tactically astute, understood the nuances of qualifying matches v tournaments, was able to switch his game plan when required, motivated the team to go out and perform on the pitch... you always felt that, whoever was out on the pitch, they would at least remain comptetitive.

Two big but's...
1. the whole Eileen Drury thing and bizarre views on handicapped people. The press will never allow anyone to forget that.
2. he's been out of the top level game for a long time. His venture down in Jerez means he hasn't worked with top players for a long long time, although he has probably seen some of the technical training and development that Spanish youngsters go through, which isn't a bad thing.

Re Hoddle and that side its also worth remembering that there were some really good players in that England squad who were fresh of a successful(ish) 96 Euros under Venables.
Shearer was only 27, Scholes was 23, Beckham, Adams, Campbell, Ince, Seaman, Neville, Anderton, Owen (oh how good was he in that game against Argentina..), Keown, Merson, McManaman. Basically it was a really good squad certainly compared to the one that he would inherit now so debateable if he could do as well with the players we currently have.
Main worry right now is where are all teh young English strikers...who are any good anyway. Carroll...oh dear, Sturridge who Ive never been that sold on is looking very average though being played out of position admittedly. But taken as a whole the cupboard does look very bare apart from Rooney. Walcott another possibility I guess.
Like I say back in 98 we had Shearer, Sheringham, Owen and Ferdinand. Cant remember why Fowler never went, crocked or form ? Should have been at his peak then. Oh where did it all go wrong.

Good points Diggs and with respect to the current crop of players, I believe whoever gets the job needs to start with the kids. The U21 players plus some older heads will be much better than the so called golden age who have failed miserably. As for strikers we have 2 fairly prolific players for England in Bent and Crouch, although Bent is out for this summer. Crouch's record is amazing for England as its over a goal per game, which at international level .... Goals would also come from pacey wingers like Walcott and Young as well as Rooney (Who never plays as an out and out forward anyway)

No matter which generation we are in or what players we have you will always find people saying "we must blood the youngsters".
You can't be continually preparing the next generation. Surely a sensible idea would be to approach the job as a continual series of two year plans.

At the end of the 2010 world cup you say, ok now i will build this team ready for Euro 2012. At the end of that you start looking at WC 2014 and so on.
So ok, once the 2012 euro's are out of the way it makes no sense to continue with picking say 31 year old Ashley Cole as he will be almost finished by 2014. But equally, there's no need to out 27 year old Glen Johnson for example, just because he's been around for a while, unless there is someone better.

I don't think there is ever a point where you need to ditch everything and go with 11 under 21 year olds. That's a tabloid sensationalist myth

With respect to Crouch and Bent I think in a lot of peoples minds the jury is out on them both. As you say said sadly Bent not an option which is a pity, Crouch is an enigma. Great record for country, slightly less prolific at club level and never really been adored by any set of fans. Most of his goals at international level have come against weaker teams but Im sure thats true of a lot of players, think he is 42 games, 22 goals so it is impressive for sure. I would take him but as an option off the bench as I think he can slow up a team offensively. But he is no Shearer or Owen thats for sure.

God I hate Everton. 17 games with no win against them now, toffee nosed scouse twats. Not that Im bitter or anything.

diggers wrote:God I hate Everton. 17 games with no win against them now, toffee nosed scouse twats. Not that Im bitter or anything.

Say what you mean and feel Digs. Don't hold back.

I think Everton wanted the chance to avenge the 3-0 in the last derby and break LFC hearts in the semi.

3 talking points tonight from me...

1) What do people think about the 56 day jail sentence for the guy that tweeted about Fabrice Muamba? From what I understand, the initial tweet at the time of Muamba's collapse was something like "lol is Muamba dead?". This tweet then attracted a lot of abusive replies and the guy apparently subsequently tweeted with some racist remarks. As far as I know the subsequent tweets have not been widely reported.

Now while I don't condone either the initial tweet, or if the subsequent tweets were really racist in nature I can't condone those either, but when you consider the kind of emails and text messages that most of us receive within hours of any celebrity death or global tragedy, does the punishment fit the crime here? How many of us can claim we haven't forwarded on some of the sick jokes that occur after a newsworthy event, or even if we don't forwards them on we often still have a quiet smile about them? I wonder what would have happened in the aftermath of (for example) the death of Princess Diana had Twitter been around in those days?

2) Play acting on the football pitch. A subject that comes up almost every week but watching an otherwise excellent Champions League match tonight, once again the rolling around of players is truly irritating. It makes me wonder if footballers are actually trained to do this? I remember a few years ago I used to play golf with a guy who was an ex semi-pro footballer (actually maybe full time pro but in the lower leagues of Germany). He was stood on the tee at a golf course with us and took an almighty swipe at the ball and collapsed in a moaning, whining, weeping heap as his knee gave way. Yes, he suffered a real injury to his knee ligaments but the rolling and writhing were just like a footballer. Maybe Mav can help out on this one (not picking on Mav but I know he had a similar injury) - I'm sure there was a lot of pain, but this guy wasn't going to get a yellow card for his theatrics! Is making the most of an injury a footballers thing? I've hurt myself during various sporting activities (maybe not quite as bad as a ruptured knee ligament, but still some fairly painful occurences) and I've never felt the need to roll around shouting and bawling like I've been taken down by a two-footed, studs up tackle. Am I just beng unsympathetic?

3) On a slightly lighter note - is Lionel Messi really the slightly better looking kid brother of Peter Beardsley?

Davie I think there's a slight difference between broacasting yourself to the world on Twatter/facefook, and a text message. Anyone who signs up to a social media network really need to understand the issues they could get. Any employer scans the networks to see if they can find anything about a prospective candidate for a job. I do it myself when looking at CV's, as its the place I look first. If I see someone who brags about being drunk, has pictures of him mooning, likes a bevvy and a fight .... forget it. So people can put themselves at a huge disadvantage when looking for work, as they can give a great interview but an employer never knows what they're like until its too late. Social media is now a tool in recruitment, so be careful.

I think the student who got himself locked up only has himself to blame. He had a promising career ahead of him as he was in his final year of uni', and now its all gone. I would never sign up to a social media network because I think they're a risk to yourself and your privacy

Poor Kenny, goes back to one of his old clubs taking three old players with him. Carroll does brilliantly, yes you did read that right, to round Krul and then instead of scoring attempts to qualify for the Olympic diving competition. Newcastle get lucky not to go one down and Carroll gets booked. Things go from bad to worse as Reina pickes up a stupid red card for retaliation and violent conduct, absolutely no need to do it.

Geordies score two goals to put them level with Chelsea and 11 points clear of Liverpool. But don't forget Dirk Kuyt thinks Liverpool are a better team than Newcastle.

Digs, shame you didn't get the result yesterday as you would have gone above LFC. But the Geordies have helped put a smile back on my face after that terrible performance against QPR.

Liverpool deserve all they get because if they had stuck with Hodgson they would have been challenging for top 4 this season. KD and his underhand methods of ousting RH was a joke and after spending multi millions on players has managed to have the worst run of results in the history of the club. Well done KD and all who were involved in shafting a decent bloke

I was having a good chuckle yesterday Grumps, shame we couldnt hang on but that said I would like Man City do push Man Utd all the way. In reality Id prefer them to win the league just to make a change to the usual past winners and to wipe the smug smile of Fergusons mug, looks like it wont happen though.
I hate to admit it but Pardew has done wonders for the barcodes, manager of the year really as that team was picked for nothing but failure at the start of the year.
Im not sure Hodgson would have done much this year Doc, he just wasnt wanted by anyone there including the fans, never got a fair shot at it but to me he just was a poor choice in the first place as a for the club.

I don't think Liverpool would have got.near the top four with anybody in charge. They are a poor poor team which the scousers ought to realise. You can't dine out on past glories forever, but Liverpool seem determined to.
Arsenal, Spurs, Chelsea and even Newcastle are way in front of them.

With all the talk this weekend (on here at least) being about The Masters, what about the other big sporting story of the weekend - Arsenal beating Man City at the Emirates and effectively handing the title to Man U?

As an Arsenal fan I'd have taken a point before the match if I'm being honest as that would have put us back in 3rd anyway - but the win was a real bonus and fully deserved.

Much was said before the game that the Arsenal midfield would struggle to control the centre of the pitch but it didn't work out that way - Song and Arteta supported from the back 4 by Sagna were excellent and City just looked totally disjointed

Man U surely can't lose the title now - having to lose 3 of their last 6 matches.

And then there was Balotelli

Although I like pretty much everyone else thought he should've walked for the first challenge, and it was only a matter of time before he got his marching orders, does anyone else think he's being made a bit of a scapegoat by Mancini? All this talk of letting City down (he didn't get his red card until about the 88th minute despite it should have come sooner) and if the truth be told he was about the only City player yesterday that looked as if he could rescue something for them. I'm not condoning his kicking lumps out of Sagna and Song but Mancini and City should be looking elsewhere for someone to share the blame with Mario

Arsenal played really well yesterday though losing Yaya so early hurt City. As a neutral but gutted the title race is over really but credit to Man Utd for doing what they do best, churning out the wins.

Digs, chance for revenge today? Could it be a case of 4th time lucky this season against the toffees especially with them resting players today.

As a gooner had to admit I was feeling a little anxious about the game yesterday so went to the golf course instead of watching it. Saw the highlights and I think Vermalen must have been City's best defender.

I'm not holding my breath, funnily enough have some toffees staying with us this weekend so be great if we did win.
Arsenal like a different side right now, should be enough to secure RVP for another season which is massive. Even Rosicky looked good...and keen...yesterday.

Rosicky has been up for it for a few games now, I think the game against spurs was when he really came back into it. RVP looks to have lost his scoring boots but hopefully he can find them again at Wolves this week.

And one nil to Everton.....sob.

Not only that but Norwich go 2-1 up!

St. Totteringham's day gets ever closer

diggers wrote:And one nil to Everton.....sob.

Don't bother watching anymore, Digs. Console yourself that it was the last goal in the game and there's always next year.

Fingers crossed for Norwich Davie. Have to beat Wolves on Wednesday but we should do that, but probably said that about QPR.

Loving, just loving Liverpool's slide down the table. Just need Stoke and Fulham to win later.

Tweet, tweet for the canaries. Now to do the business against Wolves and consolidate 3rd.

Stuffed again. They beat us 7-1 on the day I got engaged, must have been a sign !!
Can't believe the bar codes could finish 4th, madness.

So Spurs and Chelsea drop points yesterday and Newcastle make up some ground. Arsenal have the chance to extend their lead over the champions league challengers with a win against Wolves. Should be a formality but with Wolves desperate for points and the recent slip up against QPR who knows. Hoping, rather than expecting an Arsenal win and the onward push to celebrate St Totteringhams day.

Hooftheball could have had a real goalkeeping crisis for the FA cup semi final if the ref had a pair. Brad Jones on as sub after Doni is sent off goes from hero to villan, saves one pen and then gives away another and only got a yellow.

Backup keeper suggestions:

Suarez, good pair of hands and not afraid to throw himself to the ground.

Carroll, no chance of the ball going in the net

Any others?

1GrumpyGolfer wrote:Carroll, no chance of the ball going in the net

Bar steward; deliberately timed to prove me completely wrong.

About the only way he could score Grumps, complete lack of finesse hurl himself at the ball.
Anyone else think Agger is the scariest footballer on the planet, looks like he's straight from a BNP march.

Do you mean Martin Skrtel, Diggers? He defo has that sort of look about him!

I think they're both scary looking mofos Red. Skrtel has the traditional skinhead look but Agger's is more the shaggy Mohican. Wouldn't want to meet either in a dark alley.

Saw the second penalty and Kenny will be having nightmares over his keeper's clanger.

Redrage wrote:Do you mean Martin Skrtel, Diggers? He defo has that sort of look about him!

Yeah, was thinking Skrtel and wrote Agger...worrying. I'm sure he's a lovely lad really but he does look like a psychopath.

The guy who went from Liverpool to Chelsea (Meireles?) was even worse!

Not to mention Mr Bellamy as well. Maybe it's a Liverpool thing.

Could be a bad at the office for Wolves. 2 goals down and 1 man down in the first 11 minutes. Everyone's favourite winger appears to be up for it; brought down for a penalty and then scored less than two minutes after RVP broke his mini scoring drought.

Not taking it for granted just yet based on Blackburn yesterday but come on you Gunners!

That could be a big goal for QPR right on the stroke of half time. Could be they park the bus for the second half to try and hang on for the win.

Big results at the top and bottom of the league. Wigan receive some refereeing luck to earn their first victory over Man Utd. Man Citeh bounce back and close the gap to 5 points with Teletubby Tevez on the scoresheet. Wigan now out of the drop zone for the first time since September.

Arsenal strengthen their grip on third with a win at luckless Wolves. Terry O'Connor must think he's been thrown to them. 3 wins and 2 draws in the remaining fixtures will ensure Arsenal stay 3rd and also celebrate St Totteringham's day.

Meanwhile QPR not to be forgotten have also pulled themselves out of the drop zone. Taking a 3 goal lead into the last few minutes.

Villa surely looking anxiously over their shoulder as wins for Wigan and almost surely QPR pull them towards the fight at the bottom. No easy game for Villa at the weekend; only Man Utd who will have certainly got a bollocking from Fergie.

Absolutely incredible that Wigan beat Man U last night. Unfortunately that will give them a real boost and of course they move out of the relegation zone. They have a very real chance of staying up now, especially as their last 2 games are Blackburn and then Wolves on the last day of the season (who I assume will have nothing to play for by then ). I really need Arsenal to thump Wigan next week.

Bolton and Blackburn have some winnable games coming up, and QPR are playing well but have a tough run in.... so it is shaping up to be a nail biting battle to stay up. I think QPR has to win at West Brom at the weekend, because we aren't going to get anything at Chelsea or Man City.

Hopefully Villa can keep up their terrible run... only 2 wins in 2012.... and drop into the relegation dog fight. Alex McLeish is a terrible manager that sets out his teams to play awful Scottish football, he has really dragged Villa down since the Martin O'neill days and I really want Villa to go down.

The only positive from Wigan's win means that it does open up the tilte race again. 5 point gap, with the Manchester derby coming up in 2 weeks, hopefully we are in for an exciting finish.

raycastleunited wrote:I really want Villa to go down

Err, excuse me

For what it's worth i said a while ago that Villa are going to go down and i haven't seen anything to change that view yet so you might be in luck.
You are absolutely correct about McLeish dragging us down. I'm not sure about since O'Neill left as Houllier started the process of dragging us down quite convincingly before McLeish came in and finished the job.

You look through the starting 11 Villa have played for the last 3 games. There is not a bunch of 11 players worse than that in the Premier League.

We're 6 points clear of Bolton who re 18th. Bolton play Villa at their place yet and have a game in hand. If they win v Villa or win their game in hand, one of which is fairly likely, that leaves us 4 points clear of the drop zone being QPR and Wigan, both of whom are going well.
If you factor in that we play United this weekend which is an almost certain loss (as are most games), if either of those sides pick up points it starts to look very hairy indeed.

I suppose it wouldn't be a successful season for McLeish if he didn't get someone relegated!

I dont think Villa will go down...though it would be a bit funny MPB, you are more than due a bit of pain
I cant say I ever shed any tears for any relegated sides, basically as a mackem I know what it feels like and its not the end of the world. In fact quite often I get bored with the mediocrity of the Premier league for Sunderland, if you win one in three its good going pretty much for most sides. Whereas in the championship you can feel liek you are supporting a really successful side. That said not this season which has been a bit more fun with a little cup run thrown in as well.
Glad to see that the title race is nearly back on, we have Man Utd at home last day of the season, if its still to play for that is not a gimme result for Man Utd, certainly we could get a draw out of it. Man City have QPR who will most likely still be scrapping. Be great to have a proper nail biter last day at both ends oft he league.

Who would have thought this a few days ago. The Villa Bolton game will be huge now. Blackburn must be kicking themselves that they got nothing out of the Hooftheball game. Glad to see we still have interest at the top and bottom.

We've had more than enough pain Digs

It all started with Man City stealing our captain in 2009/10 which was the beginning of the end.

That was followed by being stitched up out of the league cup final a couple of years back v United when Vidic should have been sent off in the first 10 mins but apparently taking out Agbonlahor on the 6 yard line with no one but the keeper in sight was deemed not to be a goalscoring opportunity.

Then came the second attack by Man City when they took our best player that season in Milner which ultimately led to the resignation of a certain Mr O'Neill who you may have heard of.

In came Houllier - more pain!
Just when you think it can't get worse.............. McLeish arrives.

Sell our best player Ashley Young
Sell our next best player Stewart Downing

Best defender Dunne injured long term, best forward Bent injured long term, captain gets leukemia

Finished off by getting relegated

It really is going well

Exactly mate......so you go down and the only way then is back up. When did you last get relegated, mid 80's ?